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The AIH Transcript for May 18, 2018

Hosts: Carol Off and Jeff Douglas

STORIES FROM THIS EPISODE

Prologue

CAROL OFF: Hello, I’m Carol Off.

JEFF DOUGLAS: Good evening, I’m Jeff Douglas. This is “As It Happens”

[Music: Theme]

JD: Tonight:

CO: Thoughts and predators. Just after classes started this morning at Santa Fe High School in Texas, the shooting started. And a Grade 10 student tells us about making her escape as soon as the gunman's rampage began.

JD: Holding forth on being held responsible. After a week of Israel and the U.S. blaming Hamas for the violence at the Israel-Gaza fence, we'll go to Hamas directly, and ask what blame it deserves for Monday's deaths.

CO: Taking a pounding...away. For the first time, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration approves a medication specifically designed to prevent migraines — doctors say it could be life-changing.

JD: Good hair day. Yesterday, a cease-and-desist order from a major chain threatened to eclipse a Nova Scotia Barber's clippers. but today, his legal troubles are over, because his case was cut-and-dried.

CO: A hitch in time saves Ninth. A conductor says that, because he sped up and slowed down the tempo, his new recording of Beethoven's Ninth Symphony is what the composer intended. and he'll tell us about the andante-ing task.

JD: And...members only. Upset that he was among the local artists excluded from a celebration in the Dutch city of Leeuwarden, our guest builds a special fountain anyway — with a distinctly phallic theme.

"As It Happens", the Friday edition. Radio that gives you the willies.

[Music: Theme]

Part one: Texas school shooting, Beethoven’s 9^th Symphony

Texas school shooting

Guest: Dakota Shrader

JD: It was a different high school, in a different part of the United States. But the details are depressingly similar. Police say that, this morning, a 17-year-old student walked into a school in Santa Fe, Texas, and began shooting. Here is some of the police dispatch audio, recorded as the shooting unfolded.

SOUNDCLIP

DISPATCH: Shooting at Santa Fe school, 1600 Highway 6. Shooting at the school.

CAR 31: Thirty-one, we’re making entry.

DISPATCH: More shots fired. Additional shots fired.

CAR 31: We have several shots fired.

JD: That was the sound of police dispatchers and officers in Santa Fe, Texas responding to a shooting at the high school this morning. In the end, at least 10 people were killed. Dakota Shrader is a Grade 10 student at Santa Fe High School. We reached her in Santa Fe.

CO: Dakota, how are you now?

DAKOTA SHRADER: Still a little shook and just stressed out a little bit, but overall, I'm glad I'm home safe.

CO: Can you just tell us what happened today? When did you first know something was going on?

DS: Well, I first noticed that something was going on around 7:40. The alarms started going off, and you know I just thought it was a normal procedure you know because we have those every once in a while. The fire alarms go off and we go outside, walk. And this time it just didn't sound right — I had that feeling. And you know we walk outside. Everybody’s you know just thinking it's a normal day. And then all of a sudden our teachers are telling us to get over on this side. Come over on this side. And next thing you know we hear boom, boom, boom three times straight, clear. And then you just hear everybody screaming, “Run, run, run. Everyone’s saying run. And me and Ryan — my friend — we knew what to do, but we didn't know who to trust. So it was just us. We brought just into the woods because everybody else was going towards the street more. And once we got into the woods, you know I was panicking a little bit, like I've never actually been through something this chaotic. And as I'm panicking, I start to have an asthma attack, and that just makes me you know freak out a little bit more. I'm sitting here on the phone with my mom. I can't even explain to her what's going on.

CO: You said most of the kids started heading to the street, and then you headed to the woods. Why did you go there? What were you hoping to do?

DS: I went to the woods because I didn't know who to trust at that point. I didn't know who had a gun. I didn't want to trust anybody. And I just felt safe with who I was with.

CO: What did your mom say? What was the conversation with your mom that you were able to have?

DS: I just I couldn't really talk at that point. My asthma was really, really bad, but she was very concerned you know trying to get words out of me. And I ended up telling her like there's possibly a shooting going on. And I just want you to know that I love you. I'm safe. I'm hiding. And I sent her my location just in case.

CO: Just in case what?

DS: Somebody came after me.

CO: When did you come out of the woods?

DS: Like about 10 minutes into it.

CO: And what did you do after that?

DS: We went straight across the highway to my friend's house. And the cops weren't letting us crossing the street or anything, but me and my friend we just pushed through it because I had to get somewhere that I knew that I felt safe at.

CO: Did you see what was going on? Could you see what the police were doing? We saw pictures of helicopters, police cars obviously. What did you know about what was going on?

DS: Well, I do know that this shooter was just walking around hurting people and killing people and shooting them. And I didn't physically see anybody get shot. Thank the Lord. But actually, one of my friends ended up getting shot in the process.

CO: Oh Dakota, I'm so sorry.

DS: Yeah, it's upsetting.

CO: Is your friend OK?

DS: Yes. She is doing better. She's in very good condition.

CO: Is she in hospital?

DS: Yes.

CO: And what else have you learned about what happened inside the school?

DS: Somebody just came in the school acting normal, and you know next thing you know he just said, “Surprise” and just started shooting people.

CO: Is that what you've heard? That you said, “Surprise”, and then started to shoot?

DS: Yes. I didn't hear it myself, but my friends did hear it around where he was at.

CO: And what did your mom say to you when she's on the phone? How did she help you?

DS: She asked me to just breathe through my nose and out my mouth. You know just trying to calm me down so I wouldn’t freak out as much.

CO: She must have been going through hell too?

DS: Oh yes, she was. She was all the way in Webster, going about 85 down the highway just to come get me.

CO: And when she saw you how was that? When you finally got to be with your mom?

DS: I just felt so relieved at that point. My mom is my person. And that's who I go to. And I just felt beyond safe with her.

CO: And we know from other interviews we've done that there are in most schools now you get drills. You're supposed to be prepared for an active shooter. That you go through all kinds of drills and training for that. Do you have that at your school?

DS: No, we don't. We never had a shooting drill. They maybe have told us to you know get under the desk or take low. But I mean everybody knows that. I think our school shooter took that into custody back when the February false alarm shooting happened. We should have had procedures back then.

CO: You had a false alarm shooting?

DS: Yes, back in February.

CO: And so after that false alarm — and what you know about what happened at Stoneman Douglas — how does it feel that this happened at your school?

DS: I feel scared. At this point, I don't even want to go to school anymore. I don't feel safe to go to school. And you know that's where I spend most of my time to get my education. How can I sit there and learn and educate myself being scared sitting at my desk, thinking that anybody in this class could have a gun? Anybody could come up to me and just try to shoot me or kill me. It's just not a safe environment anymore I feel like.

CO: How could they make it a safe environment for you?

DS: Maybe stricter gun control. I mean I don't even know like how is it possible for somebody to come in our school with a gun? There are cops, and I respect everybody that came out to help us. But it all comes down to stricter gun laws.

CO: And do you know anything about the person who was the active shooter? Do you know who it was?

DS: They have one in custody. One of the shooters in custody.

CO: Is it your sense that it was one of the students at the school?

DS: Yes.

CO: Are you OK, Dakota?

DS: Honestly, I will be traumatized for a long time from this.

CO: I can hear your mom there. Your mom's with you?

DS: Yes, ma'am. She's on the phone as well.

CO: OK. Do you think would be going to school soon — going back?

DS: No, I will not. No. My mom does not feel safe taking me to school — somewhere I should feel safe at. But it's all come down to this horrible, terrifying experience. Nobody would want to go back to school after this. I mean people got shot and killed our school. Who would want to go back to school after that? That's just a terrible reminder of what just happened.

CO: Dakota, I'm so sorry this happened to you and at your school. But I really appreciate that you would speak with us. Thank you.

DS: You're very welcome.

JD: Dakota Shrader is a Grade 10 student at Santa Fe High School. We reached her in Santa Fe, Texas. We have more on this story on our website. That is: www.cbc.ca/aih. Soon after the shooting, local news crews stopped to interview a man carrying an American flag, and a holstered pistol, they asked him where he was going. What he was doing there. Here is the voice of that man — and another bystander who stepped in to talk to the cameras right after.

SOUNDCLIP

REPORTER: What was going through your head when you found out going on?

GUN GUY: Into the school. Make America great again.

REPORTER: By doing what? What was your plan of action?

GUN GUY: Offering support. God bless you all will go along ways right now for a lot of people. Thank you. I'm going to head this way. God bless y’all

BYSTANDER: We need prayers. We need prayers, OK? This idiot is walking down the street with a damn pistol on his side where we just had kids get shot, OK? I'm a gun rights person. I have guns, OK? But this idiot is walking down here, and saying that he needs to make America great again. That's not what America needs. America needs prayers. We don't need this crap. I'm sorry, I believe in the Second Amendment. I believe in everything. But this guy right here is walking into a crime scene with a pistol on him. And I hope they get him because this is a crime scene. This is an embarrassment.

JD: That was an unnamed person being interviewed by local news crews in Santa Fe, Texas this morning. He was reacting to another man who had shown up at the scene of a school shooting, carrying an American flag and a holstered pistol on his hip.

[Music: Up-tempo]

Rising sea levels

JD: Alabama Congressman Mo Brooks is a glass-half-full kind of guy. And you know what happens if you put a rock in that half-full glass? That glass gets fuller. But what if the glass isn't a glass — but it’s the oceans of the world? If things fall into those oceans, what will happen? They'll get higher. That seems pretty simple. But on Wednesday, at a U.S. House Science Committee hearing, the Republican Congressman had trouble convincing Dr. Phil Duffy. Dr. Duffy is the president of the Woods Hole Research Center in Massachusetts, which focuses on the threats posed by climate change. During that hearing, he blamed human activity for rising sea levels. Then Congressman Brooks confronted Dr. Duffy with his own theories. Here's part of their exchange.

SOUNDCLIP

MO BROOKS: In particular, Dr. Duffy, You said they're going to be massive. Isn't that the word that you use in your remarks? Massive sea level rises. Don't you think if you’re putting out that kind of statement, you ought to have some idea as to what all the causes of sea level rises have been?

PHIL DUFFY: Sure, and if you're referring to ground subsidence that is a factor in some regions.

MB: OK, what else. That's one. So now we've gotten two. What else?

PD: Ground subsidence is not going to cause the levels of sea level rise that arouse my concern.

MB: I'm just asking for factors. I was not asking for your prioritizing of one over the other, but you've mentioned two. What else?

PD: Those are all that I know of.

MB: What about erosion? Every single year that we're on earth, you have huge tons of silt deposited by the Mississippi River, by the Amazon River, by the Nile, by every major river system. And for that matter, creek all the way down to the smaller systems. And every time you have that soil or rock — whatever it is that is deposited into the seas — that forces the sea levels to rise. Because now you've got less space in those oceans because the bottom is moving up. What about… the white cliffs of Dover? California, where you have the waves crashing against the shorelines, and time and time again you’re having the cliffs crash into the sea. All of that displaces water, which forces it to rise, does it not?

PD: I'm pretty sure that on human timescales, those are minuscule effects.

JD: That was Alabama Republican Congressman Mo Brooks, telling physicist, former White House science advisor, and current president of the Woods Hole Research Center Dr. Phil Duffy that a major cause of sea-level rise is silt, and rocks falling in the ocean.

[Music: World music]

Beethoven’s 9^th Symphony

Guest: Benjamin Zander

JD: Even if you are not a classical music aficionado, you know Beethoven's Ninth Symphony. It is one of the most frequently performed and recorded pieces in the canon. But take a listen to this new recording of the first movement.

[Music: An arrangement of Beethoven’s Ninth Symphony done by Benjamin Zander and the London Philharmonia]

JD: Sounds different, does it not? A little faster — a little zippier. That performance was by London's Philharmonia Orchestra, led by conductor Benjamin Zander. It's part of a recording of the symphony that's set to be released in July. And even though there are too many recordings of Beethoven's Ninth out there to count, Mr. Zander believes his new one is unique, and uniquely authentic. Because he believes it comes closest to sounding the way Beethoven intended it to. Mr. Zander is the conductor and co-founder of the Boston Philharmonic. We reached him in Boston.

CO: Mr. Zander, what have you done to Beethoven's Ninth Symphony?

BENJAMIN ZANDER: It's what Beethoven has done to us. Not what I've done to him. All they've done is looked at what he wrote, and looked carefully at what he wrote, and taken it seriously, and then realized it as best we can with a great orchestra — one of the greatest orchestras of the world, the Philharmonia — great chorus soloists. And a lot of time to put into making a recording that reflects and reveals everything that Beethoven had in his mind.

CO: The version we heard — the first version that the Berlin State Orchestra version of that — that's what most people are familiar with. That's the tempo that I think I've never heard the symphony played otherwise. So it that wrong what people have been doing with Beethoven's Ninth?

BZ: It is wrong because Beethoven was very specific about what tempo he wanted for that first movement — and, in fact, for the entire piece. And he was able to deliver his intention because of the invention of the metronome. And he was thrilled at the discovery of the metronome. He was so happy and so relieved that at last people were going to be able to play his music the way he wanted it, which already they were not doing in his own time. Since then, people have got even further away from it. The romantics took it away. They turned it into something quite different. And that kind of amorphous beginning that you heard without pulse and without great drama it has a certain power, but the ferocity of Beethoven's vision — the drive of it — that doesn't come out until you play it at his tempo. Now, it's not as if other people haven't also discovered that. And there are many recordings — particularly newer recordings — that do it at his tempo. There's no other performance of the whole piece which does everything that he said. I think this is clearly the first time that all the demands of that composer have been met. And it comes out sounding very differently, in fact in a couple of places, shockingly different. So that people if they're driving, they run the risk of driving off the road if they hear it.

CO: Well, let’s hear a bit of that. This is part of the second movement. You suggested that we play this. Not as much as we'd like to, but let’s have a listen to this.

[Music: the second movement of Beethoven’s Ninth Symphony as played by Benjamin Zander and the London Philharmonia]

CO: Oh my goodness! People are driving off the road.

BZ: Your listeners are hearing that. They're the first people ever to hear that because this is the first time today that this recording has been broadcast. SO it’s a pretty exciting moment.

CO: It's very exciting to listen to. My heart’s racing as I listen to that.

BZ: Yeah, yeah, and it's a thrilling and Beethovenian idea. He marked it presto. In fact at one point, he marked it prestissimo. He obviously wanted it very, very fast. And then it got confused. People thought it was half as fast. And then other people just threw their hands up and said Okay, this metronome nonsense we can't take any notice of it. So this is the first time actually that an orchestra has realized that. So it's a very exciting moment. And there are several other moments during the piece that people will find equally exciting and new. And the whole impact of the piece, which in our recording lasts 58 minutes, and in most recordings are in 65-70 you know — and some of them up near 78. So somehow 20 minutes have been lost. But not all the tempi are faster. Some are actually slower then Beethoven's tempi are slower than are usually done some of them. And a few are completely normal.

CO: I wonder what it was like I mean when you were trying to conduct the Philharmonia to do it this way. I mean these are musicians who have played or heard it as we all have for all of these years. How difficult was it to coax this out of them?

BZ: It was very interesting, Carol, because they were so relieved and so thrilled. And the chorus. Oh my goodness, the chorus arrived in a state of oh my God, here we go again. Beethoven's Ninth — can't stand another performance. And they were electrified by it. We had three rehearsals to relearn the piece from the ground up. And then five recording sessions to make sure that nothing was left to chance. And Beethoven was present — he was up in the balcony. He was looking down on us. And every time I did something that wasn't quite right, he grimaced at me, and got very upset. And I said excuse me, Master. Forgive me. I'll do it right. And so his presence was absolutely an essential part of the experience because he said so often, “I want my music to be played exactly the way I wrote it. Don't change it.” He said it over and over and over again.

CO: So that's from the point of view of the musicians. But just from the point of view of the audience because this isn't just that you have a speeded up version of what we've heard. So what is the quality of Beethoven's Ninth that you want people to get from this?

BZ: Well, I think the Beethoven's Ninth is not only one of the most important musical statements ever made. I think it may be the greatest symphony ever written. And it has had a profound influence on the way we think about life. The hymn at the end — the Hymn to Joy — is a statement for all mankind for all time. And the journey from the darkest beginnings and the most traumatic tension at the beginning, and the final explosion of joy at the end is one of the greatest statements ever made by a human being. And it's a statement for everybody. And so I want people to hear it minted new with a ferocious, exciting nobility and intensity. And that's what it’s got from this performance. And it was a thrilling undertaking. And I spent a long time. I mean I started 50 years ago thinking about this. And to bring it to fruition as I near 80 years of age is a very, very satisfying experience I assure you. And I want people to fall in love again with the Beethoven life.

CO: we are going to get let them hear Hymn to Joy right now. But before that I'm going to say thank you, Mr. Zander. This has been really interesting.

BZ: Well, it's very exciting for me that the Canadians are the first people to hear this because you understand this has not been played to anybody yet. What they're hearing is the very first time that this music has been heard since the earliest performance with Beethoven present. So that a very exciting moment. I'm very grateful to you.

CO: All right. Let’s hear it. Mr. Zander, thank you.

BZ: Pleasure.

JD: Benjamin Zander is the conductor and co-founder of the Boston Philharmonic. We reached him in Boston. And his recording of Beethoven's Ninth Symphony will be released in July.

[Music: Orchestral]

Part two: Israel-Gaza: Hamas, penis art

Israel-Gaza: Hamas

Guest: Ahmed Yousef

JD: At the UN Human Rights Council today, members voted to launch an independent investigation into Israel's killing of Palestinians this week at the Israel-Gaza fence. Sixty-two people were killed, more than 2-thousand injured. In a speech, High Commissioner Zeid Ra'ad al Hussein placed the blame squarely on Israel.

SOUNDCLIP

ZEID AL HUSSEIN: Israel, as an occupying power under international law, is obligated to protect the population of Gaza and ensure their welfare. But they are in essence caged in a toxic slum from birth to death, deprived of dignity, dehumanized by the Israeli authorities to such a point it appears officials do not even consider that these men and women have a right as well as every reason to protest.

JD: On Tuesday's program, we interviewed Michael Oren, Deputy Minister of Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's office. He said Hamas was responsible for Monday's death toll and violence at the Israel-Gaza fence. Ahmed Yousef is a member of Hamas, and a former senior adviser to Hamas leader Ismail Haniyeh. We reached him in Gaza City.

CO: Mr. Yousef, we have heard from Israel, who says that Hamas is responsible for all 62 Palestinian deaths this week. Does Hamas have blood on its hands?

AHMED YOUSEF: No, actually the whole march was peaceful, and the people who'd been gathered there is from all walks of life. Actually the main idea created by young people, who've lost everything, and they decided to march to the border to remind the whole world that there is still a Palestinian after 70 years stateless. And they are still living in refugee camps, hoping the world conscience will be shaken and try to do certain things. All the time is trying to demonize that.

CO: It beggars belief for you to say that Hamas didn't have responsibility in this. Did you not urge people to go to the fence?

AY: No, what urging the people to go to the fence is a co-ordination — high co-ordination — National Committee. That encouraging people every week to March to the border peacefully, using a non-belligerent approach. We never hear that one Israeli being injured or killed.

CO: But I want to ask you what Hamas’s role is? We’ve spoken with Israel. But Israel warned on Monday that if Palestinians approached the fence — if they got within metres of it — that they would be shot. They were warned of that. So why would you encourage people to go to the fence knowing that it was likely and quite possible that the IDF would shoot at them?

AY: Because we are living in 70 years stateless, and we see Israeli occupation, Gaza being under siege, and sanctioned. And we can continue losing everything because we are squeezed to the corner as Palestinians living in Gaza in big prison. We are acting according to the international law. We are not doing anything illegal.

CO: OK, what I’m trying to do is determine what role — what responsibility — Hamas has for the numbers of deaths on Monday? New York Times reported that Hamas had told people during the day prayers that the fence had been already breached, and that it was open. And it said that Palestinians were flooding into Israel, and that people should join them. The Washington Post reported that organizers urged protesters over loudspeakers at the fence to burst through the fence, and told them that Israeli soldiers were fleeing their positions, even though they were actually reinforcing them. Did you not encourage people to go to the fence to try to push through it knowing that there would likely be killed.

AY: Ma’am, I was there. I met many of those people in Western media — I met more than 30 of them, and we've been talking all the time. But this is the propaganda of Israel.

CO: No, Washington Post and The New York Times who were there and saw this.

AY: But if you are in the field, you didn't see any of these things yet.

CO: Is it not true that the intention is this was to break through the fence? And did you not have the intentions of Hamas people trying to get into Israel to do what ever you could do when you got in there? Was that not the intention of breaking through the fence?

AY: Ma'am, with all due respect to you, can you imagine that there are a hundred thousand or at least a quarter of a million people marching to the fence and causing nothing to the Israeli side. There is no single Israeli been injured or killed. So why are you buying the Israeli propaganda and saying these things? Show me the facts, and then we can talk. This is unfair.

CO: And they would agree that there were no Israeli casualties during these conflicts. But that doesn't mean that Hamas was not intending them. Haaretz has reported that Hamas had posted pictures and maps on Sunday of routes from the border fence once inside to nearby Israeli… Is that not true, sir? Did that not happen?

AY: Ma'am, I hope that you will be fair. The maps and things people is reading these things through that social media.

CO: So you’re saying it’s not true?

AY: There is nothing Hamas on their website or anything like this. But this is not the credible source for information.

CO: But do they not want to get through the fence? Do they not want to push through the fence?

AY: Oh, this is their right. This is legal. I mean the people broke the Berlin Wall and in South Africa. You break the fence. The fence is in our land. It’s still in our land.

CO: But sis, you know from your own charter that the intention of Hamas is the destruction of Israel. And so the Israelis are asking if the fence had been breached, would Hamas operatives — combatants — not have gone into Israel with the intention of hurting and harming Israelis? Is that not true?

AY: What we can destruct of Israel? Israel has the nuclear weapons, and they can smash the whole Gaza Strip or the West Bank. This is nonsense. What the Palestinian and Hamas even in their charter last year, they have said that we would like to have a two-state solution. We might have one-state solution or a bi-national state. We are ready to live together in peace and harmony, but this is the Zionist project to uproot all the Palestinians from their own land and kick them out. That's why we are living in refugee camps, and trying to remind the world community about our miserable life and our suffering.

CO: A Senior Hamas officials said this week that 50 of the 62 people who have died were members of Hamas.

AY: No, I don't think so.

CO: This is not Israeli propaganda. This is your own officials.

AY: Look, look, I know that what the Israelis enjoying to listen…

CO: I'm sorry, sir. This is Hamas who said this.

AY: The evidence it there; we went to the funerals. You know in funerals because the family doesn't have money. So sometimes they are adopting this political faction because they might be able to cover them expenses for medical treatment or something like this. And that's why the people waving the flags of certain organization because they know that they might be able to cover their expenses.

CO: But we know and we've seen the majority of the Palestinians who turned up at these demonstrations were completely nonviolent, peaceful protesters, unarmed. And yet, there are images and video of Palestinians shooting Israeli drones with guns. So were there not weapons at the fence?

AY: Ma’am, please, please, be fair. This is in our territories. We have to defend ourselves.

CO: OK, so they were guns tough? You’re saying there were guns then?

AY: We are defending our life because of the drones taking photos and shooting, and they killed many of the people. If anybody crosses your house, you will shoot him. I was in America, I was in Canada, and many other places. People there can’t transgress the lands of your house. You have the right to kill him. Those drones all the time they're eating with us. They are shooting on our people. And we have to defend ourselves if the people shoot with guns to these drones or something like that. This is our obligation.

CO: Hamas has already promised a new protest on June 5th at the fence. And on the other day, I asked the Israeli government official we spoke with I asked him is there any limit to the numbers of protesters that Israel would be willing to kill? I'm going to ask you Is there a limit to the numbers of Palestinians you would urge to become martyrs and put themselves in the way of death?

AY: No, ma'am. That is a limit for sacrifice. Our land is still occupied, and we are willing to have normal lives. We need to create a future for our children like your children. Maybe in few years, a few months, people will wake up and say enough is enough to Israel.

CO: Mr. Yousef, I appreciate your time. Thank you.

AY: Thank you very much, ma'am.

JD: Ahmed Yousef is a member of Hamas and a former senior adviser to Hamas leader Ismail Haniyeh. We reached Mr. Yousef in Gaza City.

[Music: Industrial]

Homless shopping cart

JD: An unlikely pair are working on improving an unlikelier invention. Metro Community Church in Kelowna B.C. partnered with UBC-Okanagan engineering students to improve the shopping cart, and they're doing it with the intrest of the community's homeless at heart. The homeless, of course, use shopping carts to store and transport their belongings. But existing carts offer no protection from rain or theft. Not to mention, they belong to the supermarkets. Devin Siebenga of the Metro Community Church showed off the prototype that they've developed, to CBC's Brady Strachan in Kelowna.

SOUNDCLIP

DEVIN SIEBENGA: What we have here is our first prototype for our personal belongings carrier for members of our community. It's a great substitution for what you see now as shopping carts or makeshift carts, and just a way to provide security and ownership around our community members’ goods. Right now, there's a lot of anxiety around you know protecting your goods and keeping it out of the weather. And often, they’re in stolen shopping carts or in you know unsuitable carriers. And a lot of our people spend most their days worrying about or trying to like take care of or track down their stuff. And so we want to remove and help remove that stress, and take a step closer to housing. It's kind of the size of a locker — a personal locker on wheels. It's got a cool kind of profile. It's all composite material. You know the idea is to have something that is secure, lightweight, but also you know whether tight, and can handle a lot of abuse. It’s going to live outside basically, right? So there's been a lot of thought that's gone into it. I think there's obviously you know we see opportunity for improvement on it as it's you know the first rendition that we've got. But we're really excited about having it hit the streets and get feedback of the actual users, right? And I think that's most important. So we've got a couple of bike tires here, so you know it can handle some different terrain, as well as we’ve got access panels on either side with adjustable shelving. The other thing is there's a hitch at the front here which is pretty neat. So that actually has a component that you can add and hook onto your pedal bike, and be towed behind your bike.

JD: That was Devin Siebenga of the Metro Community Church in Kelowna, B.C. He's teamed up with students at UBC-Okanagan's Engineering Department to create carts for those living on the streets, as an alternative to shopping carts.

[Music: Ambient]

Penis art

Guest: Henk de Boer

JD: Usually, organ donations are welcomed. But even Henk de Boer would admit he didn't donate all those organs out of the kindness of his heart. Mr. de Boer is a Dutch artist. He lives in the city of Leeuwarden, which was chosen by the EU as the European Capital of Culture for 2018. But Mr. de Boer says he and other local artists were excluded from the festivities. Those festivities include the unveiling of 11 fountains in cities across the region. The majority of which were designed by artists from elsewhere. And so, in response, Henk de Boer has supplied his own, crowd-funded fountain. You could say it has a phallic theme. In fact, you couldn't say it doesn't. We reached Mr. de Boer in Workum, just south of Leeuwarden.

CO: Can you describe your work? This is inspiration for us?

HENK DE BOER: Well, we made a public toilet. And it's in the middle of a whole bunch of penises. And we thought a penis is the oldest form of something spraying. And also, “Jan Lul” — The word in Dutch for a penis — and the common people we call “Jan Lul” the man in the street who doesn't have anything to say, and is never asked for something — we call it “Jan Lul” and that's the fun.

CO: What does it translate to — “Jan Lul” — the name?

HDB: John Willie. John Dick.

CO: You say a bunch of penises. I mean how many penises are we talking here?

HDB: There are 240 around it. Those are funded by the crowd — funded by the crowd members, and 34 up above the toilet — the fountain — on the upper side.

CO: And so does it actually squirt water?

HDB: Yeah, when somebody takes a leak, then the fountain will spray. So he has to go inside — she has to go inside — It's gender neutral. So if they go inside and take a leak, the fountain will spray.

CO: The whole point of this was that you were excluded from — you and other people who live in Leeuwarden — were not included in this project to build these fountains that would commemorate that Leeuwarden became Europe's capital of culture for 2018. So how are people responding to your unofficial entry into the fountain project?

HDB: Everybody recognizes their feelings about the other fountains. They are top down. It's a top down project. The important people never asked us about designs or what kind of people the fountains would make. You know the motto of cultural capital is, “community”. Everybody should join, but the 11 fountains is an example where nobody is joining, except the people who rule things. They want to have names. When you've got no name, you have to prove yourself twice, thrice, a hundred times before it would become art.

CO: Well, I have to say that looking at images of your fountain, this is not easy to ignore. I'm sure people are paying attention. Do you think that by virtue of this, you have proven yourself? That you are part of the league?

HDB: That's for sure, but the elite will always say, “Well, Henk de Boer, what are the paupers?

CO: But the thing is though I understand is that the creators of the 11 fountains project now have said that your fountain — because it's become so popular with the public — it's now listed on the official program of the fountains. So it seems like you have made an impact?

HDB: Yeah, because we got so many responses for crowd-funding, and people wanted to join with us. Then the board of the Cultural Capital thought probably if you can’t beat them, join them. But we continue to say what we have to say. We want to do make it clear why we're angry, disappointed, and we want to make our statement.

CO: Well, you seem to have. You've upstaged them. And I understand it's mobile, are you going to take it on the road.

HDB: Yeah, we thought the eleven cities are rather famous. In Friesland, they've got a fountain. The rest of all the towns have no fountain. And those 11 fountains stay forever in the cities. So we said we make a fountain, and we make it mobile, so every place in Friesland can have the feeling oh, we are part of it.

CO: And plus, they can have a place to pee.

HDB: Yeah, and a place to pee. And that makes it an ultimate community project.

CO: Art you can use. Henk, it’s good to talk to you, and congratulations. Have a good evening, Henk.

HDB: Yeah, you too.

CO: Bye.

JD: Henk de Boer is the artist behind a phallic fountain, currently on display in the Netherlands' Leeuwarden region. We reached Mr. de Boer in nearby Workum. And if you would like to see some photographs of Mr. de Boer's fountain, visit our website: www.cbc.ca/aih.

Weed flag

JD: Canada produces 80 per cent of the world's supply of maple syrup. Plus, we've got maple trees are all over the place. So — although it was the subject of furious debate across the country in the '60s — it does make sense for us to have a maple leaf on our flag. In Kanepi, Estonia, they don't seem to have any maples at all. But since three districts merged to become one last July, the community has been searching for some kind of symbol that reflects their shared beliefs — and shared leaf — which turns out to be a cannabis leaf. Late last year, a vote was held to select a new emblem. Out of seven designs, the one with the silver cannabis leaf on a green shield won handily. And on Tuesday, Kanepi Municipal Council voted in favour of a flag that looks a lot like Canada's — only with green bars on the left and right, and a cannabis leaf where our maple leaf goes. It's not that surprising really. "Kanepi" actually means "cannabis", because a long time ago, hemp-processing was a major industry in the region. Still, the council vote was close: 9 to 8. One councillor pointed out that, as a drug, cannabis is illegal there — adding, quote, "I must say that I'm against the fact that we will be marching under this sort of a flag." Unquote. That's unfortunate, but that councillor can take some solace in the fact, now, his community has made international news. If I'd mentioned Kanepi to you last week, you probably wouldn't have even heard of it. But after this bold flag choice, we all have a brand-new frame of reefer-ence.

Part three: Migraine drug, Venezuela prison, stained-glass Bach and Beethoven windows

Migraine drug

Guest: Amaal Starling

JD: If you suffer from migraines, the world of medicine doesn't have much to offer you. There are medications for other conditions which may also help prevent migraines — or they may not. And some say the side effects of such drugs can be worse than the migraines themselves, but that all may be about to change — in the U.S., anyway. Because south of the border, the Food and Drug Administration has just approved the first-ever drug designed to prevent migraines. It's called Aimovig. Dr. Amaal Starling is a neurologist and migraine specialist at the Mayo Clinic. We reached her in San Diego.

CO: Dr. Starling, first of all, why is this so important? What's the significance of this new drug?

AMAAL STARLING: There are so many people in the world with migraine. It affects women, men, children of all socioeconomic stages. And so in a disease that is so common, in fact, it's more common than diabetes and asthma combined. It is amazing how many people are being effectively treated. The fact is a majority of individuals with migraines are not being effectively treated. And one of the reasons is because we do not have a lot of specifically designed treatment options for migraines. In fact, the currently available drug is actually a first-in-class preventive treatment for migraines that is specifically designed for the disease process itself.

CO: How will people take this medication?

AS: So this medication is a monoclonal antibody, and it is a large molecule or protein. And so it's not something that can be taken orally. The one that is currently available — the one that just recently got FDA approved — will be an injection. It will be a subcutaneous injection that individuals will provide to themselves in their comfort of their own home, either in the belly, or in the arm, or in the thigh.

CO: And if you can do it in layman's terms, how does it work?

AS: So what it does is it reduces the activity of something called the CGRP. We've been studying this protein in migraines for quite some time — from back in the ‘80s. We found that during a migraine attack, this peptide is elevated. When a migraine attack is treated, this peptide is reduced. When we infuse someone or give someone this peptide, it actually can cause a migraine attack. So the hypothesis was if we can reduce the activity of this protein, then we can treat migraines. And so they developed this other protein. And what it does is it basically attaches to CGRP and inactivate it. So there's less CGRP activity. And what we're seeing is that is resulting in less frequent migraine attacks.

CO: Less frequent. So how effective is it? I mean it doesn't completely eliminate migraines. So what does it do?

AS: You're right. So this is not a cure for migraines. This is a treatment that will reduce the frequency of migraine attacks. And what they found is that 40 to 50 per cent of individuals in the clinical trials had less than 50 per cent migraine attacks after they were using this medication. So, for example, if someone was having 14 migraine attacks per month, with the use of this medication if they fall in that subgroup for whom it is effective, they will have seven or less migraine attacks per month.

CO: And for those patients who would be taking this, what difference will it make for their lives?

AS: If they fall in that subgroup of patients for whom it's very effective, it could be life-changing for those individuals. I mean migraine can be a very debilitating and disabling disease. And so for those individuals, it may give them their life back. I am excited about this specific medication, but what I'm more excited about is we're finally starting to treat migraines based on the underlying disease process, rather than borrowing from other diseases, rather than borrowing medications from other disease processes. Now, were designing medications for migraine, and treating people with migraines. That's a paradigm shift.

CO: What's it like to have a migraine headache?

AS: So it's important to remember that migraine is not just a headache. Migraine is a disease of the brain. And people that have migraine, they have attacks of debilitating head pain, as well as other associated symptoms. They may have sensitivity to light, sound, motion, as well as nausea and vomiting. So for many individuals, they have to go into a dark, quiet room, isolate themselves from their work environment, their family environment, and really be alone in the dark by themselves to try to get through this attack that they may be having.

CO: So just finally, why has it taken so long to come up with a drug like this?

AS: There, unfortunately, has been a paucity of funding for headache disorders, and specifically for migraines. So the question is well why is that? If this is something that is so common and so disabling for so many people, why is it that there is so little funding for research? And one of the answers to that is stigma. Migraine has a lot of stigma. And it's combined because there is a lot of stigma with chronic pain conditions, and migraine does have pain as a component of its attacks. In addition, oftentimes there's reduced funding for diseases that disproportionately affect women. And migraine has a higher impact in women. It affects women more commonly than men. So that may be another reason why there is additional stigma and reduced funding, and thus, reduced novel drug treatments available for migraines. Oftentimes, diseases that disproportionately affect women are not taken seriously. If a woman comes in to a provider’s office, they may think oh well, it's just the headache. It's just stress. Just drink a little bit of water. You'll be ok. Rather than taking it seriously and understanding this is a neurological disease that we can treat.

CO: All right. We will leave it there. Interesting and very important news for a lot of people who are listening to this, Dr. Starling. Thank you.

AS: You're very, very welcome. Thank you for your time.

JD: Dr. Amaal Starling is a neurologist and migraine specialist at the Mayo Clinic. We reached her in San Diego. And we did get in touch with Health Canada to ask whether Aimovig will be available here any time soon. They told us it's currently under review, but they couldn't say when it might be approved.

[Music: Ambient]

Tommy Barber

JD: Thong Luong is used to giving close shaves. But this time, he experienced one himself. Last night on the program, we spoke with Mr. Luong, who is the owner of Tommy's Barber Shop down in Dartmouth, Nova Scotia. He'd received a cease-and-desist letter from the national barbershop chain Tommy Gun's. It said that his shop violated the chain's trademark — despite the differences in the businesses' names, and the fact that Mr. Luong had opened his shop six years earlier. After listening to our interview, many of you wrote back in support of Mr. Luong, and against the national giant. On Twitter, @tim_of_ottawa said: "Can't believe Tommy Gun's would 'cease & desist' a Vietnamese-Canadian refugee who started Tommy's in Dartmouth, 6 years BEFORE Tommy Gun's got to Canada. Sorry gang, I liked ya, but I'm never going back." And Brett Walker tweeted, "Tommy Gun's, lay off Tommy's Barber Shop!...His seven customers a day is taking nothing from you." Well, soon after our interview aired, the underdog won. After a huge backlash on social media, Tommy Gun's issued an apology — and said it won't be taking any further action against the Mr. Luong's shop. Earlier today, Thong Luong spoke to CBC Radio's “Maritime Noon”. Here's part of his conversation with host Norma Lee McLeod.

SOUNDCLIP

THONG LUONG: I feel so good. And I feel so thankful to everyone that cares about me and helped me out with this. And you know what? Like, my daughter she was upset and she was crying. And I told her I said, “A lot of nice people help Daddy, so don’t worry. We will pull through this.” And last night she came home from PEI, and I told her the good news, and she was so happy.

JD: That was Thong Luong, the owner of Tommy's Barber Shop in Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, on CBC Radio's “Maritime Noon”.

[Music: Movie soundtrack]

Venezuela prison

Guest: Phil Gunson

JD: The Venezuelan government says it's taken back control of what was supposed to be its most secure political prison. An uprising began on Wednesday. By yesterday, family and friends had gathered outside the downtown fortress, to share messages and smartphone videos that their loved ones had sent from inside. Today though, one of the opposition leaders has sent out a message, saying that they were back in their cells. All of this comes in the run-up to Sunday's presidential election — an election that's taking place amidst hyper-inflation, a collapsing economy, and widespread hunger. Phil Gunson is the International Crisis Group's Senior Analyst in Caracas. And that's where we reached him.

CO: Mr. Gunson, we’ll get to the election in a moment. But what caused this prison uprising?

PHIL GUNSON: Well, in in essence, these are a mix of political and ordinary criminals held in intelligence headquarters — the state security if you like and in Caracas — and held many cases without even being given a trial. Some of them have been ordered released by the courts, but the state security ignores those orders. They're often, according to their own version, badly treated. The particular trigger for this incident was the beating of one of the political prisoners. Photographs of him appeared on social media showing him quite badly beaten around the face. And that seems to have triggered a reaction not just by the political prisoners, but also by a majority of the common criminals there, who basically took over the facility and made all sorts of demands of the authorities.

CO: Who are the political prisoners, and why are they there?

PG: They’re are a mix of people. I mean the guy who's been most sort of front-and-centre in that particular group — and it's worth pointing out that there are other political prisoners held in other facilities — but this particular guy Daniel Ceballos is the former mayor of a town along the border with Colombia. But there are students, young people, underage people in some cases, who are there for demonstrating, or one way or another, being dissidents. And, as I say, many of the cases are extremely irregular in the sense that some of them have not even been presented in court. They include Joshua Holt, who is a U.S. citizen accused of being a spy — a Mormon who married or was about to marry a Venezuelan that he'd met over the Internet. So that's clearly one of the cases that attracted most international attention.

CO: Is there any coincidence that this this uprising has happened just days before Sunday's election where Nicolas Maduro is seeking another six-year term?

PG: Well, that's an interesting question. And we don't really know the answer to that. It has been pointed out by a number of people that it's very strange that this incident was allowed to take such an enormous amount of space on social media in the sense that the prisoners were able to record videos and send them out. And this went on for hours in a state security facility, where you know there is equipment for jamming those signals. They ought not even to have phones in the first place, and so on. So there is some suspicion that there might have been some internal complicity, although nobody's been quite able to understand why.

Co: but when you see a riot at a prison with major opposition figures being part of the uprising — which is held just a few days before the presidential election— how was President Maduro responding to this?

PG: With silence effectively. The only statement I've seen out of anybody official really has been the I suppose you'd call in the attorney general. In reality, he's kind of the chief prosecutor — in theory, a figure who is independent, but in practice, a political appointee. His statement was more or less along the lines of well, you know move along, nothing to see here. You know everything's under control, the prisoners are okay, and end of story. Whereas what he should be doing, of course, is investigating the claims of the prisoners relatives and the prisoners themselves that their rights are being violated.

CO: The fact that there are so many political prisoners in jail, and the threat to those others who may get out of line that they would have the same fate. How much doubt is there is the outcome of Sunday's election for President Maduro?

PG: Well, there's always a chance I suppose that the government has miscalculated, and that something could go wrong. But they've taken every possible step to make sure that despite his enormous unpopularity, that the president will be re-elected. I mean they've banned the most popular opposition politicians, canceled the registration of several important parties, the election condition in general are extremely unfair. The government has massive media access, and uses state resources absolutely shamelessly in violation of the law. And if all else fails, then they can count on the control of the electoral authority and the Supreme Court. So, institutionally, they pretty much have it sewn up. Now, there is a possibility that more votes might be cast for Henri Falcon, or even potentially the third candidate in the race, Bertucci. If that were to happen, I think most commentators here think that the government would manipulate the count.

CO: And what does another six years of Chávez-Maduro style government mean for the people of Venezuela?

PG: Well, it means that we continue on the same trajectory because there doesn't appear to be any intention on the part of the government to change policies. So we're into hyperinflation. The inflation rate is running at something like an annual 13,000 per cent at the moment. Prices are doubling pretty much every month. There is acute scarcity of food, medicine, and all kinds of other basic goods. The Health Services is collapsing. Public services, including things like water, electricity, are extremely irregular. People often go weeks without electricity or without running water. And people are fleeing in very large numbers because, to be honest, for many people to stay here is almost a death sentence. Either you die of hunger or you die of preventable diseases. So that's really what's in store. It’s bad enough already and it's unimaginable what it could be calm if there is no change of policy.

CO: We'll be following this closely, Mr. Gunson. I appreciate speaking with you tonight. Thank you.

PG: Thank you very much.

JD: Phil Gunson is a Senior Analyst with the International Crisis Group. We reached him in Caracas.

[Music: World music]

Interrupting study

JD: We all know it's rude to interrupt. But — just a second, let me finish — it does turn out that we don't always agree on what constitutes an interruption. Wait! New research from Stanford University says whether we feel interrupted depends a lot on who's talking, and how. Doctoral candidate Katherine Hilton played the same audio clips for five thousand subjects. And people who agreed interrupting is a no-no disagreed about other things. Here's the first of those clips.

SOUNDCLIP

SPEAKER ONE: Well, we can still make it on time if we leave now.

SPEAKER TWO: Maybe, but I don't think it'll be right to go without them.

SPEAKER ONE: Yeah, it's probably better if we just wait for them.

JD: Did she interrupt him? Ms. Hilton says most Americans say no. She didn't raise her voice of change the subject, and so she was just making conversation — but what about this example?

SOUNDCLIP

SPEAKER ONE: Well, we can still make it on time if we leave now.

SPEAKER TWO: Maybe, but I don't think it'll be right to go…

SPEAKER ONE: Anyway, have you heard from anyone else?

JD: See, In this clip, most listeners agreed: that was an interruption. But here's where it gets tricky: whether participants felt the man was interrupted depended on what kind of speakers they were. High-intensity speakers — who are uncomfortable with silence — were more likely to treat the interruption as friendly banter. But low-intensity speakers felt any cross-talk was an interruption. And gender complicated things still further.

SOUNDCLIP

SPEAKER TWO: Well, we can still make it on time if we leave now.

SPEAKER ONE: Maybe, but I don't think I'd be right… here.

SPEAKER TWO: Yeah, it's probably better if we just wait for them.

JD: Sound familiar? Same script as the first clip, genders reversed. And that clip had listeners feeling much more divided about whether Speaker Number Two got cut off. And the reversal had a huge impact on how the interrupter was perceived by male listeners — who found the woman interrupting to be ruder, less friendly and — get this — less intelligent than the man interrupting. So, in conclusion…

[Music: A minor annoyance]

JD: That’s an interruption. That was an interruption.

Stained-galls Bach and Beethoven

Guest: Shirley Ann Brown

JD: "I would love to find those windows. Believe me, I have looked." That's what the director of operations at Toronto's Massey Hall and nearby Roy Thomson Hall told the StarMetro earlier this year, as the paper was looking into the mystery. The windows he was referring to were a pair of stained-glass pieces — one of Bach, one of Beethoven — that go back to the 1800s. But for years, they were missing — that is, until they were found not too far away in the basement of Roy Thomson Hall. Shirley Ann Brown is an expert in Canadian stained glass who last saw the Bach and Beethoven windows in 1991, and photographed them. We reached Ms. Brown in Toronto.

CO: Shirley Ann, what did you think could happen to these two stained-glass windows?

SHIRLEY ANN BROWN: Well, I had suspected all along once I was contacted in December about the issue that they were somewhere. I couldn't believe that they had just disappeared, or that somebody had taken them because there are a good size. And they're fairly damaged, so they wouldn't be attractive to anybody who wanted them to hang in a window.

CO: And what were the theories? Some people thought that they had been destroyed, they were stolen. What were the ideas?

SAB: Well, since they couldn't find him at that point, and they had said at Massey Hall and at Roy Thomson that they had looked everywhere, I thought well, I don't think they could possibly be destroyed. It's possible that they were hidden in the basement when the building was Allan building demolished, but they insisted they had gone through everything. But I couldn't believe that they disappeared, so I just assumed that they were maybe in Roy Thompson.

CO: And that's exactly what you found.

SAB: And that's exactly what was found.

CO: They were installed in Massey Hall, right? When it was built?

SAB: Yeah, they were installed in Massey Hall with the other windows in 1894 — well, by the time it was opened in 1894.

CO: And what were the other windows?

SAB: There were 12 composer windows all together. So there were 10 others, various composers, some 18^th-century 19th century, all the way from Bach. I think it was the earliest one up to Chopin in the 19th century. Wagner. I'm trying to think here… there was Haydn, Handel, Bach, Beethoven, Chopin, Rossini, Waber, Aguanno, Mendelssohn, Mozart, and a couple of other.

CO: Well done. I think you passed the exam.

SAB: I don’t have the list in front of me.

CO: Well done. And they are known as the “Twelve Apostles of Music”, right?

SAB: Well, I called them that because when the windows were installed around the main floor of the auditorium, it kind of gave you the feeling of being in a nice Methodist church or something.

CO: Okay, so how did Bach and Beethoven get separated from the gang?

SAB: Well, actually, four of them were separated out from the gang. Haydn and Handel suffered the same fate, except they were in very, very good condition. And so they were put up in the windows in the manager's office. So they were never lost. But Bach and Beethoven were fairly damaged, and so they just shoved them down the basement. And this was a long time ago — at least by 1933, when the windows were boarded up. They were already taken out.

CO: Boarded up? So the other eight were boarded up then?

SAB: Yeah, they were all boarded up. Yes.

CO: Why did they board them up?

SAB: Oh, I think for a number of reasons. All the windows in the hall are actually double sash windows. They open up vertically so that air could be brought in, which is fine in 1894. By the 1930s, you've got a lot of cars. So you've got pollution. You've got a city that burns a lot of coal, a lot of wood, it's very dirty. It's a bigger city now — there's always possibility of damage from the street because these are right at street level. So I think for security they were boarded up, and also because they wanted a dark house.

CO: Did people remember? Was there a historical memory that underneath these panels of wood that there were actually these exquisite stained-glass windows?

SAB: No, at least by the time I arrived on the scene in 1991, there wasn't. Because when I saw that Haydn and in the Handel windows in the manager's office, I asked well, where did these come from? Well, we're not sure. And it was later that summer that they actually opened up one of the windows for me on the ground level. And it was the Mendelssohn window. This was August of ‘91. And so I immediately realized that the other windows — those four windows — were part of same series. And that there must have been similar composer windows, except the whole window not just the centre part with the portraits that they were still in existence, so I asked them about it. They said they didn't know. But let's have a look. It took a long time — about two years — before I went back in ’93, and they actually un-boarded all of the ground floor windows for me. So I got a chance to look at and to photograph all of the remaining eight.

CO: So you knew where Haydn and Handel were hanging out. And you knew with these eight were there. But since 1991, you have wondered about Bach and Beethoven.

SAB: Oh, I actually didn't think much about them because I had published an article in Rotunda in 1993, which included pictures of Bach and Beethoven and Bill Kilbourn’s book on Massey Hall actually featured the Haydn and the Handel and the Mendelssohn window. And so at that point, I just simply dropped the whole thing because there was no sense of restoration of the building or anything. I'd done my job, and I didn't think about them really again until they started to restore some of the windows oh, about a decade ago.

CO: And then what brought the Bach and Beethoven to light now?

SAB: Oh, well, it was very funny. It was at one of the Messiah productions before Christmas in December. And I wasn't there, but apparently, the Tafelmusik choir director stood up. He was dressed like Handel, and he made a joke saying oh, something to the effect — because I'm getting this second-hand — something to the effect that oh well, it's fortunate that my two great rivals, Bach and Beethoven, disappeared a long time ago. And that was picked up by a reporter for The Star who was there.

CO: Now where are your apostles going to be now? Are you going to get them reinstalled?

SAB: Oh well, not right away because all the windows are gone now. Every window is taken out of the building for the restoration. The remaining apostles were taken out in August, put away in storage until they can be restored. And I guess the four free floaters have now also been wrapped up and put in storage with the rest of the windows. I don't know when they're going to get around to actually restoring them.

CO: But they will be reunited?

SAB: They will all be reunited, and they will all be somehow inserted back into their original openings.

CO: At Massey Hall?

SAB: At the new Massey Hall.

CO: Shirley Ann, thank you for telling the story.

SAB: Well, it's a wonderful story. It was great fun to work on it.

CO: Thank you.

SAB: OK.

CO: Bye.

SAB: Bye.

JD: That was Professor Emeritus Shirley ANN Brown. We reached her in Toronto.

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The AIH Transcript for May 18, 2018

STORIES FROM THIS EPISODE

Prologue

Part one: Texas school shooting, Beethoven’s 9th Symphony

Texas school shooting

Rising sea levels

Beethoven’s 9th Symphony

Part two: Israel-Gaza: Hamas, penis art

Israel-Gaza: Hamas

Homless shopping cart

Penis art

Weed flag

Part three: Migraine drug, Venezuela prison, stained-glass Bach and Beethoven windows

Migraine drug

Tommy Barber

Venezuela prison

Interrupting study

Stained-galls Bach and Beethoven

Part one: Texas school shooting, Beethoven’s 9^th Symphony

Beethoven’s 9^th Symphony

May 18, 2018 episode transcript

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